Author Topic: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help  (Read 4215 times)

Offline Two52

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Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« on: April 15, 2009, 05:47:36 PM »
Beta 2 is nearly done.  I have put together a preview build for you guys to test out.  It has tons of bug fixes, animated tiles in platforms, better item menus in world mode, shy guy tag mode, major world editor improvements and boss mode minigames.  Speaking of the boss mode minigames, boses now have 5 difficulty levels and I would like your help to set these levels.  

The preview build below is a "debug" build.  This means that the debug keys are enabled during play.  You'll be able to drop items using the 0-9 number keys + SHIFT + CTRL, adjust the framerate with the "[" and "]" keys, kill everyone by pressing "z", freeze random players by pressing "x", shield random players by pressing "c", and do lots of killing by pressing "F5".  Anyway, these debug features probably won't be too interesting, but I've added some special boss tweaking features that can set the difficulty level on the fly as you're playing the boss.  This should help you get a feel for the boss as you are adjusting his settings.

So when you start up smw, select start, then the boss mode minigame will automatically be selected.  You can choose between hammer, bomb and fire bosses here.  When you start the game, you'll see a black bar at the top of the screen (if you don't, press the "v" key).  This is where the boss's settings are displayed.  To change the difficulty level of the boss, press the "-" and "=" keys.  By changing the difficulty level, you are selecting which level of boss you are setting the values for.

The first set of values you see are the "Action Probability" settings.  This is how frequent an action will be chosen by the boss.  You have 100 points to spend between Stomp (super attack), throw (projectile), turn (face left/right), wait (just sit there), taunt (do that little dance, bomb brother has a defense move when he taunts), and move.  You'll see as you adjust one setting, the setting to the right also changes.  You are stealing or giving points to the setting to the right by setting the current setting.  You can't adjust the "move" action as that is the right most setting and it is the default bucket that gets any points that are left over.  If you set a setting to 0, that manuver will never be selected by probability.  But that doesn't necessarily mean the action will never happen, because that action can be forced (covered below).

To select the setting you want to adjust, press the "b" key until your action is selected (the selected action has a bigger font).  To adust the selected setting, press "<" and ">" to make it smaller or bigger respectively.  The green/red boxes you see highlighting the actions is the action that the boss is currently performing.  If it is green, that means it was selected by probability.  If it is red, that means it was forced.  To switch through the setting types from probability to the next one, press "n".  

By pressing "n", you'll go to the next group of settings, "Force Action".  If an action doesn't happen for a certain amount of actions, then it is forced to happen.  So if stomp is set to 12, that means that every 12 actions a stomp will be forced to happen.  If the action happens before 12 because it was selected by probability (described above), then great, it will reset and wait another 12 to be forced.  Use the same keys above to adjust the settings here.

Pressing "n" again will get you to "Maximum Action In A Row" settings.  This is the number of actions that can happen in a row before some other action must happen.  So if throw is set to 3, then a maximum of 3 projectiles can be thrown in a row before the boss must do something else.  Keep in mind that any other action counts so he could throw 3, then wait, then throw 3 which would almost look like throwing 6.

Pressing "n" again takes you to "Wait Time".  This is the amount of time that the boss waits when he does a "wait" or "turn" action.  The first value is the minimum time and the second value it the maximum time.  The times are in frames which means that 60 is about 1 second.

At any time you can press the "p" key to flush your settings to a file.  This generated file is called "sledge_brother_settings.txt" and is placed in the same folder as supermariowar.exe.  It contains the code that I need to put the settings into smw.  This file is also appended to when you exit automatically.  The file is always appended to so you'll see multiple sets of settings in there if you've saved or exited multiple times.  Nothing is lost.  Also, when you exit, your settings are saved into the game so when you start it up again, you'll have the settings you left off with.

At any time, you can press the "v" key to make the black bar at the top disappear/reappear so that you can play the boss without interference.

So, what I'd like you to do is play around with the settings and come up with what you think are fair settings for each difficulty level.  I have put some pretty good settings in there, I think, so play each boss and see if you find them impossibly hard or too easy and tweak from there.  When you think you have a good set, send me the code block from your sledge_brother_settings.txt file in a PM or email.

Oh, and I'm sure it goes with out saying but don't forward this around.  It isn't quite ready and it would cause confusion.  The masses will get beta 2 soon enough :)
http://http://smw.supersanctuary.net/18Beta2BossSettings/smw-1.8-beta2-boss-settings.zip

Offline MrMister

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Re: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« Reply #1 on: April 15, 2009, 07:10:48 PM »


Two52 you're actually getting me to work on SMWar content again. :)

Offline KingPepe

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Re: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« Reply #2 on: April 15, 2009, 07:30:24 PM »
Quote
...dang it, I knew I started my mod at the wrong time. XD (Then again, not the worst thing in the world)
The game shouldn't change too much so your mod will probably work fine.

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2. Can't set a Min and Max to the same number. Otherwise, game crashes.
Huh, you're right.  Don't do that. :)  Settings won't be written out if the game crashes :(

Quote
...and when there's an explosion on the Bro, can you not make it repeat the hit sound?
Fixed.

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Times today are just as bad what with the video game market being made up of 80% first person shooters that are 80% brown and 20% black and 100% bloom.

Offline Link901

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Re: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« Reply #3 on: April 15, 2009, 08:48:56 PM »
It'd be good to keep in mind that that F5 mass killing thing is a toggle. I turned it on and couldn't figure out why my lives were rapidly dropping in number when I started new matches.
Also, how do you restore the default settings to the Sledge Bros. that you had when you released this? If you have to do it manually in-game, we might want to put the defaults up in this topic so we can remember them.
I'm testing the Sledge Bros. battles with the same method we used in 1.7's AFE by fighting with only 5 lives to see how difficult it was to do. I'd say it gives a fair measure of difficulty that way, since you actually have to worry about dying.
The Hammer Sledge Bro is actually tweaked quite nicely already. The easy modes were easy, and the hard modes were challenging. Very Hard had me on the edge of my seat through most of the battle.
The Fire Sledge Bro seems pretty well tweaked too, in my opinion. Very Hard didn't quite have me on the edge of my seat, but then again, the Fire Sledge Bro always seemed pretty easy to beat.
The Bomb Sledge Bro seemed a bit on the easy side, but I never had any problems with it in 1.7 either. I did come across a strange quirk though. I'm not quite sure how it happens, but once in a while when I throw bombs back at the Sledge Bro, they'll bounce upward or fly further forward suddenly. Any ideas why it's doing that?
Shy Guy Tag is pretty fun, but there's a small bug to it. On Unlimited, whoever scores the first point wins the match. Also, we might want to look into a different skin for the Shy Guy, since it's in the regular skins too. I can see that causing some serious confusion. Maybe we could switch it out with SGraff's or something.

Offline Agastya

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Re: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2009, 10:22:14 PM »
ahahah i broke it.

Set anything else's Force Action to 0, and it will eventually get around to other actions.

Set Stomp's Force Action to 0 though, and let the hilarity commence.

Offline JJames19119

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Re: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2009, 10:30:16 PM »
I found that the difficulties are nicely balanced except for the harder difficulties, in which they seemed just as easy as the moderate difficulty, mainly due to one thing I couldn't control in the debug features you supplied: the movement speed.

There's less pause between actions when moving up a difficulty past moderate but when the boss starts moving, he moves so ungodly slow that the battle becomes very trivial; It was usually enough time for me to hunt a koopa shell and easily pass it into the boss in the hammer brother challenge, even on very hard. I think the challenges above moderate would definitely earn their names if the brothers could be sped up in their movement functions so that there isn't such a noticably huge gap between actions compared to when the brother is doing something else.

EDIT: AI seems to have a rough time being a shy guy...the invincibility from environmental hazards causes them to get stuck standing on some because it's telling them to avoid it regardless of the invincibility. It'd also be nice if the sound cue played every second of the free time remaining once everyone was a shy guy, to better let the players know when it would be ending.

I'll keep posting the more I test it!

Offline Link901

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Re: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« Reply #6 on: April 15, 2009, 11:22:52 PM »
I'm personally not that fond of the race lap sound cue for changing back from a Shy Guy, but that's just me.
I didn't have AI problems because I tested it on a map that didn't have environmental hazards. It was the snowball fight map, actually.
Anyways, the reason I posted. I love the new changes to the world editor, it's so much nicer now! It crashes if you press enter when you're attaching bonus items to a level, though. Not sure why.
I'm still trying everything out though.

Offline General Guy

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Re: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« Reply #7 on: April 16, 2009, 04:35:03 AM »
Thanks a lot for the beta, two!
That was an unexpected pm for sure :D
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Offline JJames19119

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Re: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« Reply #8 on: April 16, 2009, 03:14:44 PM »
New bug: Pressing 3 in the world editor and trying to go over to the fifth page of the object select by pressing 5 closes the selector, but when you press 5 without pressing 3, you go into the fifth page of the object selector anyway, going into the same mode. I'm pretty sure it didn't work like that before.

Also, can someone please tell me how the hell to give players other then player 1 initial items in the world editor? ;;

Offline Link901

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Re: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« Reply #9 on: April 16, 2009, 05:10:35 PM »
Umm, JJ. The initial items for world maps apply to all 4 players at once. You just pick the items and all 4 start with them.

Offline Jared

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Re: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« Reply #10 on: April 16, 2009, 09:29:09 PM »
Well, I haven't played with it much but when I press Escape at the end of a boss fight (after a win), the game crashes.

Also, can you explain what the three options for Shy Guy Tag mode are?

Offline Two52

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Re: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« Reply #11 on: April 17, 2009, 12:11:29 AM »
Quote from: "Link901"
Also, how do you restore the default settings to the Sledge Bros. that you had when you released this? If you have to do it manually in-game, we might want to put the defaults up in this topic so we can remember them.
Delete the file called "sledge.bin".  Your settings will reset to the defaults.

Quote from: "Link901"
The Bomb Sledge Bro seemed a bit on the easy side, but I never had any problems with it in 1.7 either. I did come across a strange quirk though. I'm not quite sure how it happens, but once in a while when I throw bombs back at the Sledge Bro, they'll bounce upward or fly further forward suddenly. Any ideas why it's doing that?
The bomb brother's taunt move is now a defensive manuver where he pushes bombs away.  Let me know if it doesn't look right.

Quote from: "Jared"
Also, can you explain what the three options for Shy Guy Tag mode are?
The three options for shy guy tag are:
1) Suicide Tag - If you kill yourself, you become a shy guy
2) Tag Transfer - touch only will only transfer a shy guy when touching someone, kills only will only transfer if you kill another player, touch and kills is both.
3) Free Time - the amount of time that it takes for everyone to be freed once you all become shy guys

Offline General Guy

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Re: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« Reply #12 on: April 17, 2009, 08:34:24 AM »
Okay, sorry that i havn't really commented on the new version, guys, but i had plenty to do.
the entire thing doesn't run for me at all. when i try to open it, i get a message which tells me that i am lacking a file named MSVCP71D.dll. i remember having a same problem back then when you sent me the upgraded .exe for the halloween edition.

greetings though and thanks for still working on SMW =D
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Offline Tanuki

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Re: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« Reply #13 on: April 17, 2009, 10:05:29 AM »
Quote from: "General Guy"
Okay, sorry that i havn't really commented on the new version, guys, but i had plenty to do.
the entire thing doesn't run for me at all. when i try to open it, i get a message which tells me that i am lacking a file named MSVCP71D.dll. i remember having a same problem back then when you sent me the upgraded .exe for the halloween edition.

greetings though and thanks for still working on SMW =D
Happened to me too, just go google the dll files and download them.

Offline Two52

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Re: Beta 2 Preview - Boss Difficulty Setting Help
« Reply #14 on: April 17, 2009, 12:08:50 PM »
Ah, yes.  If you had the DLL problem before and had to download it, you'll have to do that again.  You'll notice this time the DLL name ends in D and last time it ended in R.  The D stands for Debug and the R stands for Release.  Those are the only two types so you'll be able to play any version I send out once you have both.